Despite the little bumper sticker used to illustrate this article, Trump Tower is not "Mine."
In fact Trump actually owns very little within Trump Tower besides his own (lied about the size under oath ) personal residence, some commercial operations within the building, the garage, etc. It is a condominium building as are many of "Trump's" other NYC buildings. There are many "owners," some rather shady like the name on the building.
He does not "own" 40 Wall Street, for example. He controls the ground rent. Moreover, he does not even own the ground according to Curbed, the NYC real estate watchdog site: some other family does.
Realizing how limited his personal equity is in most of these properties explains a lot about why he found it so hard to get all the bond money he needed. He does not have as much collateral to put up as security as we were led to believe. (His golf course properties may be a different deal.)
It would be nice if the media in general quit fluffing up his reputation as some kind of "powerful NYC property magnate". He is more a glorified "time share" tenant.
Until yesterday, I firmly believed that Trump was on a path of decay and could be beaten. After the NY Court reduced his dollar fine and gave him ten more days to raise the money, my heart sank. This single action spoke louder than words and told the whole entire world that judges CAN be bought, justice in the United States is a major JOKE, and our country is not based on "justice for all" but rather a corrupt system of government and laws.
I was living in Moscow when Yeltsin shot cannon fire into the Russian "White House" (their seat of government) and destroyed the building. There was instant lawlessness and snipers firing from rooftops throughout Moscow. There is a stark comparison to yesterday's Trump's NY court decision to Yeltsin's destructive behavior and instant affirmation of power.
I lost faith in our system yesterday and there were probably millions of other Americans who did as well.
If I am correct, the judge did not reduce the ultimate fine. He reduced that amount of bond money that had to be put up to continue Trump's appeal. In the end he may be just as severely punished as he would have been the day before yesterday as the total amount of assets that may be seized is the same.
Yes, true. But no one else gets this kind of consideration. Equal under the law? Apparently not. I’m pretty disgusted. And I agree with Brian, he needs to be held accountable for everyone to see he isn’t some special God-King or whatever his supporters believe. The emperor has no clothes. Let’s effin MOVE ON.
Oh, come on! That’s just the first move. Let me explain exactly how this will go. Assuming the process will work out to completion before the election, on appeal, Trump will be required to pay some portion of the posted bond and the existing stay on the order against the Trumps doing business in NY will be made permanent. That’s the entire f**king point of this last-minute decision.
This morning I received this message: "If I am correct, the judge did not reduce the ultimate fine. He reduced that amount of bond money that had to be put up to continue Trump's appeal. In the end he may be just as severely punished as he would have been the day before yesterday as the total amount of assets that may be seized is the same. Regards"
I may have been too early in my response. Let's see what happens today.
I received this message this morning, so my initial reaction may have been overkill. "If I am correct, the judge did not reduce the ultimate fine. He reduced that amount of bond money that had to be put up to continue Trump's appeal. In the end he may be just as severely punished as he would have been the day before yesterday as the total amount of assets that may be seized is the same. Regards"
Thank you for clarifying this. I absolutely did not realize it and I think others are also in the dark. I was truly depressed all day yesterday, thinking our system is broken. I will now tell others too.
What the base has long admired about Trump is his ability to move through life without accountability. Like a fairy tale potentate, Trump lives in his own universe where celebrity alone is enough to stave off consequence. His ability to set the agenda and define the contours of the playing field inspires Maga to pursue the will to power without regard to the rule of law. To see him brought to account might break that spell.
I hope you are able to contact an attorney who practices regularly in NY state courts. Bond rules vary from state to state.
I practice in MO, and here at least there is clear law (a Missouri Supreme Court decision) that the statute & rules on bonds require the losing party at trial to post a bond in the full amount + expected interest; anything less, and the trial winner may start to execute on the judgment and seize assets. I do not know the rules or practices in NY though.
This really gives me a stomach ache. It’s the same with the Supreme Court. How is it that they don’t have to explain their reasoning in these random Trump-saving decisions that to the naked eye appear straightforwardly unconstitutional or illegal? And also, WTaF?
My state of NY is such an incredibly venal and feckless excuse for a “blue” state. The libs here (Governor Kathy Hochul, House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries, recently re-elected rep Tom Suozzi, party leader Jay Jacobs) are in such thrall to real estate, finance, pharma, and restaurant lobbyists that would happily hand the state over to the right wing so long as the line goes up and they get re-elected.
They spend all their time bashing AOC and comforting Trump.
"I can’t say what the judges [on the New York State Court of Appeals] were thinking when they made this decision. Are they corrupt? Are they fearful? Are they appeasing the business community? But it’s become abundantly clear from a number of earlier episodes that many accountability figures in the country fear the MAGA bark and try to stave off a bite by taking it easy on him."
*** *** ***
I cannot say, either. And I cannot imagine any motive that would make these "accountability figures" admirable. If they are receiving death threats from Trump's minions, then I find them pitiable, but still not admirable. If we keep on pandering to bullies, bullying will become more popular, and the rule of law will become weaker.
The rescue of our democracy from incipient fascism has need of more courage than this.
Yes, it does make sense now that we have a logical explanation. However, on Monday our entire TV media announced the Trump dollar fine was reduced from $464M to $175M and the time for payment had been extended another ten days. On the surface, our justice system looked like a Mickey Mouse birthday party and Trump was the birthday boy. The whole world was laughing at the U.S. and it appeared that justice in the U.S. was a joke or the boys and girls in the black robes had been bribed.
I heard from many others - in the U.S. and abroad - who had this same impression and I was depressed the whole day. It was not until another Substack subscriber explained to me that this court decision was a bond based on Trump's appeal, and the old court decision was still in place. So thank goodness for Substack and our media gets a rating of zero for their reporting.
Yes, it does make sense now that we have a logical explanation. However, on Monday our entire TV media announced the Trump dollar fine was reduced from $464M to $175M and the time for payment had been extended another ten days. On the surface, our justice system looked like a Mickey Mouse birthday party and Trump was the birthday boy. The whole world was laughing at the U.S. and it appeared that justice in the U.S. was a joke or the boys and girls in the black robes had been bribed.
I heard from many others - in the U.S. and abroad - who had this same impression and I was depressed the whole day. It was not until another Substack subscriber explained to me that this court decision was a bond based on Trump's appeal, and the old court decision was still in place. So thank goodness for Substack and our media gets a rating of zero for their reporting.
"Unlike any other civil defendant appealing a verdict, Trump will not have to post the full judgment against him, plus interest, to defer the seizure of his assets on appeal. He can instead post about one-third of it—$175 million—while New York takes a flier on the rest. ... I can’t say what the judges were thinking when they made this decision. Are they corrupt? Are they fearful? Are they appeasing the business community?"
I practice in this court regularly and the judges are really just fine (and indeed I'd rank them among the best judges anywhere). While I would be happy to see Trump roasted, this ruling makes sense under the law.
The thinking behind this requirement is that if a trial court rules that person X is owed money by person Y, and Y wants to appeal, then X shouldn't have to bear the risk that something happens during the appeal such that Y is no longer good for the money. That's not really the situation here, because a civil penalty is not the typical civil court judgment. The state of New York was never anticipating this money and if Trump went bankrupt during the appeal the state wouldn't be out of pocket one dollar. And Trump is not wrong that if he had to sell a property in a fire sale he'd be harmed if it turned out that the appeals court agrees with him. The court has discretion to relax the bond requirement and so it has, but the bond that it imposed is still quite stiff. This is a good result for the AG.
Here is the message that I received this morning: "If I am correct, the judge did not reduce the ultimate fine. He reduced that amount of bond money that had to be put up to continue Trump's appeal. In the end he may be just as severely punished as he would have been the day before yesterday as the total amount of assets that may be seized is the same. Regards"
Despite the little bumper sticker used to illustrate this article, Trump Tower is not "Mine."
In fact Trump actually owns very little within Trump Tower besides his own (lied about the size under oath ) personal residence, some commercial operations within the building, the garage, etc. It is a condominium building as are many of "Trump's" other NYC buildings. There are many "owners," some rather shady like the name on the building.
He does not "own" 40 Wall Street, for example. He controls the ground rent. Moreover, he does not even own the ground according to Curbed, the NYC real estate watchdog site: some other family does.
Realizing how limited his personal equity is in most of these properties explains a lot about why he found it so hard to get all the bond money he needed. He does not have as much collateral to put up as security as we were led to believe. (His golf course properties may be a different deal.)
It would be nice if the media in general quit fluffing up his reputation as some kind of "powerful NYC property magnate". He is more a glorified "time share" tenant.
No wonder he looks scared.
Until yesterday, I firmly believed that Trump was on a path of decay and could be beaten. After the NY Court reduced his dollar fine and gave him ten more days to raise the money, my heart sank. This single action spoke louder than words and told the whole entire world that judges CAN be bought, justice in the United States is a major JOKE, and our country is not based on "justice for all" but rather a corrupt system of government and laws.
I was living in Moscow when Yeltsin shot cannon fire into the Russian "White House" (their seat of government) and destroyed the building. There was instant lawlessness and snipers firing from rooftops throughout Moscow. There is a stark comparison to yesterday's Trump's NY court decision to Yeltsin's destructive behavior and instant affirmation of power.
I lost faith in our system yesterday and there were probably millions of other Americans who did as well.
Elizabeth
If I am correct, the judge did not reduce the ultimate fine. He reduced that amount of bond money that had to be put up to continue Trump's appeal. In the end he may be just as severely punished as he would have been the day before yesterday as the total amount of assets that may be seized is the same.
Regards
Yes, true. But no one else gets this kind of consideration. Equal under the law? Apparently not. I’m pretty disgusted. And I agree with Brian, he needs to be held accountable for everyone to see he isn’t some special God-King or whatever his supporters believe. The emperor has no clothes. Let’s effin MOVE ON.
Actually, lots of rich or well connected people get this kind of consideration. That does not contradict the rest of your comment.
Oh, come on! That’s just the first move. Let me explain exactly how this will go. Assuming the process will work out to completion before the election, on appeal, Trump will be required to pay some portion of the posted bond and the existing stay on the order against the Trumps doing business in NY will be made permanent. That’s the entire f**king point of this last-minute decision.
This morning I received this message: "If I am correct, the judge did not reduce the ultimate fine. He reduced that amount of bond money that had to be put up to continue Trump's appeal. In the end he may be just as severely punished as he would have been the day before yesterday as the total amount of assets that may be seized is the same. Regards"
I may have been too early in my response. Let's see what happens today.
Elizabeth
I received this message this morning, so my initial reaction may have been overkill. "If I am correct, the judge did not reduce the ultimate fine. He reduced that amount of bond money that had to be put up to continue Trump's appeal. In the end he may be just as severely punished as he would have been the day before yesterday as the total amount of assets that may be seized is the same. Regards"
Weird that they don't apply the same logic to Hunter Biden.
Thank you for clarifying this. I absolutely did not realize it and I think others are also in the dark. I was truly depressed all day yesterday, thinking our system is broken. I will now tell others too.
Elizabeth
Most judges are essentially MAGATs. Same as DAs and cops . If they all were shot into the sun tomorrow the world would be a better place.
What the base has long admired about Trump is his ability to move through life without accountability. Like a fairy tale potentate, Trump lives in his own universe where celebrity alone is enough to stave off consequence. His ability to set the agenda and define the contours of the playing field inspires Maga to pursue the will to power without regard to the rule of law. To see him brought to account might break that spell.
I hope you are able to contact an attorney who practices regularly in NY state courts. Bond rules vary from state to state.
I practice in MO, and here at least there is clear law (a Missouri Supreme Court decision) that the statute & rules on bonds require the losing party at trial to post a bond in the full amount + expected interest; anything less, and the trial winner may start to execute on the judgment and seize assets. I do not know the rules or practices in NY though.
Those are the rules in NY! This is a special exemption for Trump.
This really gives me a stomach ache. It’s the same with the Supreme Court. How is it that they don’t have to explain their reasoning in these random Trump-saving decisions that to the naked eye appear straightforwardly unconstitutional or illegal? And also, WTaF?
My state of NY is such an incredibly venal and feckless excuse for a “blue” state. The libs here (Governor Kathy Hochul, House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries, recently re-elected rep Tom Suozzi, party leader Jay Jacobs) are in such thrall to real estate, finance, pharma, and restaurant lobbyists that would happily hand the state over to the right wing so long as the line goes up and they get re-elected.
They spend all their time bashing AOC and comforting Trump.
The Trump Tribe lies, cheats, blackmails, bribes and threatens.
Successfully. As we see, yet again. And the opposition just lets them do that and do that.
We’re supposed to pin our hopes on an election in five states?
Yes, we’re going to see Trump again in the Oval Office, surrounded by his cohort of thieves and fascists.
Start making plans now for where you’re going to go or what you’re going to do in 2025 as the tattered remnants of the USA we know disappear forever.
Yes, you are entirely correct and I didn't learn this information until the following day. Thanks for sharing this message.
Elizabeth
"I can’t say what the judges [on the New York State Court of Appeals] were thinking when they made this decision. Are they corrupt? Are they fearful? Are they appeasing the business community? But it’s become abundantly clear from a number of earlier episodes that many accountability figures in the country fear the MAGA bark and try to stave off a bite by taking it easy on him."
*** *** ***
I cannot say, either. And I cannot imagine any motive that would make these "accountability figures" admirable. If they are receiving death threats from Trump's minions, then I find them pitiable, but still not admirable. If we keep on pandering to bullies, bullying will become more popular, and the rule of law will become weaker.
The rescue of our democracy from incipient fascism has need of more courage than this.
Elizabeth Graham
From Democracy to Democrazy
Yes, it does make sense now that we have a logical explanation. However, on Monday our entire TV media announced the Trump dollar fine was reduced from $464M to $175M and the time for payment had been extended another ten days. On the surface, our justice system looked like a Mickey Mouse birthday party and Trump was the birthday boy. The whole world was laughing at the U.S. and it appeared that justice in the U.S. was a joke or the boys and girls in the black robes had been bribed.
I heard from many others - in the U.S. and abroad - who had this same impression and I was depressed the whole day. It was not until another Substack subscriber explained to me that this court decision was a bond based on Trump's appeal, and the old court decision was still in place. So thank goodness for Substack and our media gets a rating of zero for their reporting.
Elizabeth
www.democracy2020.org
Elizabeth Graham
From Democracy to Democrazy
Yes, it does make sense now that we have a logical explanation. However, on Monday our entire TV media announced the Trump dollar fine was reduced from $464M to $175M and the time for payment had been extended another ten days. On the surface, our justice system looked like a Mickey Mouse birthday party and Trump was the birthday boy. The whole world was laughing at the U.S. and it appeared that justice in the U.S. was a joke or the boys and girls in the black robes had been bribed.
I heard from many others - in the U.S. and abroad - who had this same impression and I was depressed the whole day. It was not until another Substack subscriber explained to me that this court decision was a bond based on Trump's appeal, and the old court decision was still in place. So thank goodness for Substack and our media gets a rating of zero for their reporting.
Elizabeth
www.democracy2020.org
"Unlike any other civil defendant appealing a verdict, Trump will not have to post the full judgment against him, plus interest, to defer the seizure of his assets on appeal. He can instead post about one-third of it—$175 million—while New York takes a flier on the rest. ... I can’t say what the judges were thinking when they made this decision. Are they corrupt? Are they fearful? Are they appeasing the business community?"
I practice in this court regularly and the judges are really just fine (and indeed I'd rank them among the best judges anywhere). While I would be happy to see Trump roasted, this ruling makes sense under the law.
The thinking behind this requirement is that if a trial court rules that person X is owed money by person Y, and Y wants to appeal, then X shouldn't have to bear the risk that something happens during the appeal such that Y is no longer good for the money. That's not really the situation here, because a civil penalty is not the typical civil court judgment. The state of New York was never anticipating this money and if Trump went bankrupt during the appeal the state wouldn't be out of pocket one dollar. And Trump is not wrong that if he had to sell a property in a fire sale he'd be harmed if it turned out that the appeals court agrees with him. The court has discretion to relax the bond requirement and so it has, but the bond that it imposed is still quite stiff. This is a good result for the AG.
Here is the message that I received this morning: "If I am correct, the judge did not reduce the ultimate fine. He reduced that amount of bond money that had to be put up to continue Trump's appeal. In the end he may be just as severely punished as he would have been the day before yesterday as the total amount of assets that may be seized is the same. Regards"